Parenting Teens in Kinship Care: Building Trust and Reducing Conflict

00:00 Introduction to the podcast

SPEAKER_00 0:00

What do you do when the child you fought so hard to protect suddenly starts pushing you away? When the I love you's are replaced by I rolls and slam doors. We often lead our teenagers from a place of fear, a fear that the generational cycle of trauma is repeating itself. But Janine Mouchoir is here today to tell you that you've actually just been promoted. It's time to stop being the micromanager, putting out fires, and start being the CEO of your family's future. Today we're learning how to find the side door to a teenager's heart. Welcome to Grandparents Raising Grandchildren, Nurturing Through Adversity. In this podcast, we will delve deep into the challenges and triumphs of grandparents raising grandchildren. As we navigate the complexities of legal, financial, and emotional support, I invite you to join us on a journey of exploring thoughts, feelings, and beliefs surrounding this growing segment of our society. Drawing from real stories and expert advice, we will explore the nuances of child rearing for children who have experienced trauma and offer valuable resources to guide you through the intricate journey of kinship care. We'll discuss how we can change the course of history by rewriting our grandchildren's future all within a supportive community that understands the unique joys and struggles. This podcast was made especially for you. Welcome to a community where your voice is heard, your experiences are valued, and your journey is honored. I've spent so many episodes talking about putting out fires. But as I look at my grandchildren growing up, I realize my biggest fear isn't the fire, it's the silence. In our last episode, we talked about permanent authority and winning the legal battle. But once the paperwork is signed, the real work of influence begins. Janine Mouchoir is my go-to expert for the teenage years. She helped me realize that our teens don't need a boss. They need a leader who has the bandwidth to listen to the watermelon jolly rancher smell without jumping to a level 10 judgment. This conversation changed how I view the Hulk brain moments in my own hallway. Welcome back, Janine. It's so nice to have you on the show again.

SPEAKER_01 3:08

Thanks for having me, Laura. Happy to be here and to be back. So fun to talk to you again.

SPEAKER_00 3:13

Yes, you are my teen caregiver go-to person.

SPEAKER_01 3:17

That's so kind. Thank you. I I am passionate about parenting teenagers. So have you been. Yes, and you have what, three boys? I have three children. I have a girl and two boys, and they're all in their 20s now. So and my daughter's actually having a baby in a few weeks. I'm going to be a grandma. Very excited.

SPEAKER_00 3:36

That is you speak from experience because you've talked to me originally in our last episode about how your go-to methods were not working when your kids became teens, and that's how you develop the philosophy and the outlook that you have.

SPEAKER_01 3:52

Yes, exactly. I think what I was doing is what I see so many of my clients do, and most parents, which is, you know, we see something that our kids are doing and we get scared or we get worried, and so we try to fix it or stop it. And in today's day and age, it just doesn't work well. Which I think most parents realize pretty quickly and they feel like they're banging their head against the wall and not effectively like guiding and influencing their kids.

SPEAKER_00 4:21

Yes. I know that oftentimes we as kinship caregivers, we lead from a place of fear, a fear that that generational cycle is repeating itself when we see a teenager pull away from us or become defiant. So, what what I want to ask you is how does a parent, especially a grandparent who feels the clock ticking, stop reacting from that fear and start leading with a presence that actually makes a teen want to open up?

SPEAKER_01 4:52

Well, that's a loaded question, Laura, and not an easy one to do. I'm I'm happy to share my thoughts on that, but I want to preface it by saying, like, that's hard to do. We're human. We see our kids or grandkids do something that concerns us, um, make anything from drinking and smoking to choosing friends that aren't a great influence or being disrespectful or sneaking around or lying, right? They they do something and we get naturally emotionally reactive to that and we get worried and scared, or oftentimes what happens next is angry and frustrated. And we think like, if you just listen to us, things would be so much easier. But they don't, right? What happens is when we lead with that fear, we end up trying to control the situation and make them stop or fix what they're doing, which when they hit the preteen and teenage years, they usually respond with some sort of resistance, right? You don't get it, you don't understand, they roll their eyes, they go in their room, slam their

Managing fear in conversations

SPEAKER_01 6:03

door, right? Whatever the flavor is for the day. And then the whole thing escalates. So you're more worried, you're more scared, you're more frustrated. What I've have noticed and experienced myself is so many of us get stuck in that loop. And what's happening is that fear and that worry is driving the conversations, and that's shutting it down. So, to your question, well, how do I not let that fear and worry drive the conversations? First is just being aware that it is, right? First is just being aware, like, okay, uh, that conversation didn't go well. Like, let me think a minute. How was I feeling going into that conversation? What was I thinking? Did I have like my doomsday thoughts on? And so I was really feeling anxious or stressed or worried because that energy carrying it into a conversation usually repels our child and they push away, they get defensive, and the conversation ends before you've even started it. So it starts with just like slowing ourselves down and being aware, okay, yeah, we're really scared right now and rightly so, but I can't carry that into my conversation or it's going to push my child away. And then, you know, I help my clients come up with a list of coping skills. I call them in-the-moment coping skills, out-of-the-moment coping skills, so that if you're in the middle of a heated conversation, what do you do to calm your nervous system, right? And like get back to that more steady, confident caregiver. And so I help clients come up with a whole list of things they can do inside the moment. For example, we always have our breath available to

Strategies for managing stress

SPEAKER_01 7:52

us. We can always slow the conversation down and just stop and pause and take a few breaths. Like it's it's actually proven that that will help reduce um the huge feelings that are going on in your nervous system, that fight or flight response, just some deep breaths. And don't be embarrassed. Just say to your kid, like, hey, you know what? I need a second and take a few breaths. That would be an in-the-moment strategy. Like an out-of-the-moment strategy is, you know, we were talking before we started recording how it's so easy to just get exhausted because we're doing so much. And so just to realize, like, okay, if we want to show up and talk to our kids where we're not drained and exhausted and we have the bandwidth to actually have a productive conversation, we need to do things outside of the moment too to restore my energy. Right. So that might be, you know, I don't I was talking to a client the other day. I said, Well, what do you do to get calm? And she's like, Well, I um like to go for a drive, fuck the dog, and shopping's the best. So, you know, but you could go for a walk outside or you could go for a run, or some people who aren't into exercise like to journal or turn some soothing music on. And so I would just really encourage um, you know, you if if you're trying to really slow that fear down, is come up with a list of things that work for you specifically that helps you feel like, okay, my shoulders aren't in my ears, my heart isn't pounding, I'm not sweating. Um, right. And I feel more grounded and steady and confident. And then I go on just to also teach about like you could have mantras that you say to yourself that feel more calming, right? We're trying to shift our focus and our thoughts. Like if we're thinking, oh my gosh, they're they're lying, they're gonna be a liar forever, I have to stop this, right? It's like, okay, how can I shift my thoughts so it's not so doomsday? Like, okay, you know, maybe something like this is just for today, not forever. Something that you can tell yourself so you're not just so scared and worried. So sorry, I cut you off.

SPEAKER_00 10:11

No, it's all right. I was thinking that my mindset these days is into seven and ten-year-olds, right? But I keep fearing the teens coming up, especially having a young girl that's about that's starting pre-teen stuff. And is it that the same with a teenager that we can be vulnerable? Like it just come from the heart and say, I'm really concerned. I'm worried about you. This is why um I want to have a talk with you.

SPEAKER_01 10:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:43

Do you find that that works for you? Well, yes, with the kids I do because they are so feeling-oriented. You know, if I tell them how I feel, like, oh, I'm really worried when you when you talk to me like that, that hurts my feelings. Do do you speak with teens that way that have gone through trauma or are uh already resistant to adults because of what they've experienced?

Approaches to parenting conversations

SPEAKER_01 11:10

There's, I mean, I love to say there's no one right way to parent. And every child is different, every parent is different. And so, you know, actually, I was listening to, I think it was Simon Sinek, I think, on a podcast with Dr. Becky Kennedy. And he was talking about in the context of leadership, that it applies to parenting, whether you're parenting an eight-year-old or a 17-year-old. But you want to meet emotion with emotion and logic with logic. So you might find, Laura, that if you're talking to a child who is very in touch with their emotions and has a high EQ, then you can enter the conversation talking about being open and vulnerable that about your fear, your worry, and trying to connect with them on that level. They might be more receptive and understanding. But if you have a child who more operates, you know, more logically, rationally, um, and isn't as high of an EQ, that might feel overwhelming to them. Like they don't know what to do with that. And, you know, I I I think it's always a uh smart thing that if you are worried or you're scared, that you first try to spend a little time taking care of your own feelings and just making sure that we're not putting that on our child. Because for most kids, if we do that, they shut down, whether they're a preteen or a teenager.

SPEAKER_00 12:40

You know, many kinship teens have a survival brain that interprets rules as threats because they've seen a traumatic experience, and that's how they interpret rules from us grandparents. But how do we use your tools to stay calm when a teen is redlining?

SPEAKER_01 13:02

Yeah. No, great question. And I couldn't agree more. They do perceive rules as threats. And if we can just wrap our head around that, it's motivating to try something different because traditionally the model was write rules and punishments. And that doesn't work great in today's day and age. You know, teens resist and they don't follow the rules. And like you said, they register it as a threat. And so for kind of moving on from that part, always first and foremost, don't skip the step of taking the time to settle your own fears and worries before you start the conversation. But from there, it's to once you recognize, okay, if I just come in with a rule and start talking about the rule, right, they're gonna shut down.

Understanding rule-breaking struggles

SPEAKER_01 13:56

But if instead I come in and I see that they're struggling, right? I know as the caregiver, they're struggling to adhere to whatever the rule is. And so instead of punishing because they broke the rule, I it's way more effective if we talk to them about their struggle. What is their struggle that caused them to break the rule and shift the conversation from, you know, you were supposed to put your phone away at eight o'clock and start homework, and I came in at 8 30 and you didn't. So I'm going to take your phone away for the week. That would be a punitive consequence versus, wow, we agreed that your phone would be put away at eight o'clock and homework would get started. What's stopping you? So you're shifting the conversation to be about the struggle. And you're assuming that you got a good kid who wants to follow the rules. They're just having a tough time doing that. And so if you can have firm boundaries with a lot of compassion, your child won't register it as a threat.

SPEAKER_00 15:07

You talked about active listening. Is that what you mean by active listening? So we're listening to hear what the real bottleneck is in communicating, figure out where we can address that together first and then move from there and make compromises.

SPEAKER_01 15:26

Yes, exactly. Right. It's it's just if we go in talking directly about breaking the rules, we don't understand all the nuance underneath of what's going on. So for example, maybe your child is still on their phone because they have a friend who's really struggling and they're on the phone trying to support them and help them. Like if you knew that, you might feel a little more flexible about the rules. It's a separate situation. Or sometimes I remember this happened to me, right? I saw my son on his phone and flipped out. And then later I realized he was actually doing a group project on his phone. But I assume because I just heard chitter chatter and laughing that he was just goofing off and not getting his work done. So I advocate slowing ourselves down. Yeah. And getting curious about, okay, huh, they're not following the rules right now. I wonder what that's about. And assuming that they don't want to break the rules, they don't want to lie or be sneaky or not follow the guidelines, and really getting curious about what's stopping them from following it. It takes your conversation in a completely different direction.

SPEAKER_00 16:45

Yeah. I I absolutely get that. It's it's it's easy for us to forget that, and especially with teens who are really feeling their independence. And our first thing that we do is jump to conclusions. And those conclusions can oftentimes be wrong, especially the way they present themselves.

SPEAKER_01 17:06

Yeah. No, absolutely. Such a good point. If we can remember that, oh, wait a minute, it's natural when they hit the preteen years for them to pull away and for them to want their independence. So if we can remember that, um, we won't be so harsh or judgmental when they appear to be doing that. And versus like, I think what happens, what I notice a lot is parents get upset or they get hurt because they feel like their child isn't coming to them as often as they used to. When it's realizing, okay, if I carry that hurt into the conversation, that's just gonna push them away more. Versus if I can come to them with more compassion and curiosity, I have a better chance of connecting with them and being able to influence them.

SPEAKER_00 17:58

Yeah, that makes sense. So parents that were high achievers pretty typically have issues with failing a connection. And many of us come from very traditional backgrounds, and we've already raised a generation of kids, and we think, oh, we've done this before. And then we are raising now this generation of teens, which is very which are very different. And and they're traumatized teens. How do we is there is there a vision? Is there a I'm looking for a one-word fix here or one word solution, or there probably isn't one. But how do we help them meet this generation of traumatized teens where they are?

SPEAKER_01 18:42

You know, if you feel like you're not connecting and you're not influencing, you know, the teen the way you want to, slow down and think about what they're going through. And sometimes a really easy hack is just like, if I was in their situation, what would I want the adult in my life to say to me? What would I want them to ask me? What would I want them to be curious about? What would I want to hear from them? And that sometimes can just immediately change the course of your conversation. And just to realize that, I mean, I grew up in a traditional house and I tried to parent my kids that way, and it worked for a while, but we're really in a whole new space, you know, with social media and tech, and you're addressing also kids who have experienced trauma. Kids, teenagers especially, they just want to feel understood. That's why you hear so often, you don't get it, you don't understand.

Understanding your child's emotions

SPEAKER_01 19:44

That's their way of saying, like, I don't feel like you really understand what I'm going through. I don't feel like you understand that I was embarrassed at school today, or I was humiliated when I asked a question in class, or I'm completely overwhelmed because I have a test coming up, I don't understand the concepts, right? When we hear I don't understand it or you don't understand, it's usually there's things going on underneath that, lots of big feelings and lots of thoughts that can create, you know, stress, anxiety, overwhelm for our kids. And so just to recognize, gosh, if I come in with that traditional parenting mode of I see concerning behavior, and then the words coming out of my mouth are directed at stopping it and fixing it versus slowing down and asking really good questions to get your child to open up and share with you what's really going on. That's what makes all the difference in the world. Like I'm thinking about before I learned these concepts, um, you know, my son was doing the e-sig thing, which smells like watermelon Jolly Rancher. And right, it's just like so gross. Or whatever flavor there's whatever flavor. That was his flavor of choice. And so, you know, there was a rule in the house, there was no smoking e-sigs, right? I'd found them before and grabbed them and threw them in the trash, trying to stop, to stop it all. And, you know, I remember like walking into the house after date night and saying, smelling that smell, and just, you know, going, just getting so mad. I'm sure I yelled at him and was just so frustrated that he's breaking the rules. After I learned this new approach that I now coach on, um, the next time something like that happened, which a similar situation happened, you know, I walked in and I said, Hey, I smell that Jolly Rancher watermelon smell. I just stated the facts, right? With no layered judgment or tone or me being super aggravated or, you know, a mixture of worry and angry. And that was all I said, you know, kind of back to your active listening, like talk. Less. Yeah. And listen more. Yeah. And so I said that and I didn't say anything else. I just stated the facts that I smelled this. And sure enough. And then I just stood there with a a neutral look on my face. And he said, Yeah, yeah, I know I'm not supposed to, mom. You know, sorry. I was like, well, what caused you to break the rules? Again, I'm getting inquisitive. I'm trying to understand.

Understanding students' anxiety struggles

SPEAKER_01 22:29

And I'm I'm taking the assumption that he didn't mean to break the rules, that he's a good kid and he's struggling. So I'm gonna get curious, like, well, what caused you to do that? Right. And then he went on to say that I'm so anxious about this test tomorrow. I feel like I don't know the information and I don't know how to learn it. And, you know, when I smoke, it immediately makes me feel better. Well, then all of a sudden we're having a very different conversation, right? I've learned you don't feel prepared for your test tomorrow. And what's going on with that? And how can we solve that together? How can we come up with ideas so you do learn the information? So your anxiety is reduced without smoking. Yeah. Right? It's like the whole conversation went into a completely different direction that was collaborative, that was calm, right? That was understanding.

SPEAKER_00 23:21

Yeah, I love that.

SPEAKER_01 23:22

You know, and did that mean that he stopped smoking immediately? No. But we started having better conversations and I started being able to help him with what was the underlying problem, what was really wrong. And once we did that, he didn't have as much of a desire to smoke. Because his anxiety had gotten lowered by me actually effectively helping him with what the real problem was.

SPEAKER_00 23:47

Yes, I love that. And I think that's what we're all working towards. As you said, if we can I can just remember sometimes to talk less and listen more. That that always works.

SPEAKER_01 23:59

It does. I mean, I help my clients are, you know, in this no, no, oh my gosh, of course not. But you know, I would find myself going on and on and on and on and on, and like my kid just like checking out. And so I help my clients with listen, just say as few words as possible. Like something like, hey, I noticed you got a D on the test. What happened? That's it. Like those five simple words or however many it was, right? And then stop talking and let them let them share with you. Not like right, we're it's kind of back to what we were talking about, talking about in the beginning. We got to say that with very neutral energy, right? If we're going in mad or angry or assuming that they didn't study and we're frustrated, those simple words aren't going to come across, right? They're still gonna be defensive. But if we can go in, you know, more thinking about, hey, this is odd. I'm sure nobody really likes getting Ds on tests, or I'm sure no one really likes missing five assignments. That creates anxiety. So if I can have like compassion for the struggle and then say those words, it comes off as more collaborative, like, okay, honey, let's work together and fix this together. And we're on the same team here, we're on the same side. Right. Right? We both want you to be the best version of yourself. I know you want to do that. I want that for you. And punishing you certainly doesn't get you get you there.

SPEAKER_00 25:29

Thank you. I think that's great advice. So, what about when a teen goes into a silent standoff? We're already there, we feel like we failed. What's the tactical move to keep the doors open when it's silent? Yeah. Common, right?

SPEAKER_01 25:44

Very calmon and really scary as a parent. I mean, we feel more calm about our children when we know what's going on. And the more it's almost like the more information we have, the calmer we can be. We can be more grounded if we actually know they're smoking versus wondering if they're smoking or not. And how often are they smoking? And right, who are they smoking with? And where are you ditching class to smoke? Right. When we have all this uncertainty and unknown, it's actually more dysregulating for us, more worrisome, more scary than if we actually just knew, okay, yes, I am smoking, and this is when I'm smoking, and this is what, right? Knew the facts. And so when our teen goes dark and silent, just to first recognize, like, yeah, that is normal, a normal parental response to be really scared and worried because there's so much unknown, right? And that unknown and uncertainty is really hard for any human to cope with.

Understanding and empathizing with teens

SPEAKER_01 26:53

And so just starting there and understanding, like, okay, that makes sense, that I'm really worried right now, and I really have this overwhelming desire to make them talk to me so I know what's going on. And just to first start with a little compassion for yourself and understanding for yourself. And then I think the next move that's helpful is to look at that situation and to look at it through the lens of my teen is really hurting right now. There is something that's so hard and so difficult and so emotionally overwhelming for them. They're only the only move they can think of to do is just to shut down and ice you out. And just having that mind shift alone helps you feel more compassionate for them. And it puts you more on like the same level that, hey, I see you're hurting. And I'm telling myself as a parent that that by you silencing, by you going into silence and not speaking to me, I'm going to tell myself that that's a message that you're really hurting and you actually really do need me and you need my understanding and you need my support. And what you really need is a safe space to open up and talk. Typically, if your child is silent and icing you out, it's because they don't feel safe sharing with you what's on their heart, right? The most common thing is they're worried you're gonna be disappointed in them, whatever is going on for them, whatever they're thinking about or something that they did, or however they're feeling. And if they think that you're gonna be disappointed in them, it's too painful to share with you. Or if they think you're going to punish them, they're definitely not gonna share with you. They're trying to avoid punishment. So

Creating a safe space for kids

SPEAKER_01 28:49

if you want to break the silence, it starts with us creating a situation, an environment and our home where our kids feel safe coming to us and talking to us. If they think we're gonna be really disappointed in them, then they feel ashamed of their behavior and of what they're doing. And no one wants to feel shame. And so if they think even subconsciously, that's the experience they're gonna have if they share with you what's on their heart, they're not gonna share. So again, it comes back to kind of where we started in the beginning. It always comes back to where our power and influence lies is first quieting our own fears and worries and frustration and helping our kids feel like, hey, listen, no matter what is going on, no matter what you've done, no matter what you're thinking or feeling, it's okay to share with me. I'm I'm not gonna punish you. I'm here to help you figure out what we should do, whatever's going on, like it's fixable. And I'm I'm here to help you with that.

SPEAKER_00 29:55

Yeah. Not easy. No, but I'm glad that you reminded us to all come back to that place of quieting our fears and then creating that space again in whatever way we can with our teen.

SPEAKER_01 30:10

Yeah. You know, I find I have this foundational five steps, and step one is that managing our own emotions, really trying to get calm and quiet the disappointment and all of that. And it's just interesting. I see time and time again, it, you know, you get like a high achiever, you know, action-oriented fixer. It's like, no, no, no, just tell me what to say. As I, okay, I I don't love scripts because I could tell you what to say, but if you're saying it while you're so scared or you're so angry, the words land very differently. Right. Right. I mean, think about if your husband walks in the door from work, probably doesn't have to say a word. And you can immediately feel like he's really happy, something good must have happened, or oh boy, he seems a little off today, a little angry. But you can feel that without that energy without him saying anything. And it's because whatever is on his mind and however he's feeling that makes up his energy. And when he you walk into a room, the people who love you the most feel that vibe and can sense that. And so our kids are the same way.

SPEAKER_00 31:22

Yeah. Yeah, that's the most important message. Well, I have three questions that I'm asking all of the people that I'm interviewing this year. I have a systematic question, a taboo question, and a policy question. This will be fun. Okay. Let's hear it. I think you'll like these. Society tells us that rebellion is normal, but in kinship care, rebellion looks like a dangerous relapse of the past, right? We go, my gosh, they're just like my son who's in jail now or in rehab. How do we distinguish between normal teen development and a systematic problem that's going to repeat itself?

SPEAKER_01 32:07

Mm-hmm. Yeah, that's a hard one, huh? Um, I mean, belling is scary. What I know to be true is that, you know, caregivers, whether it's a parent or a grandparent, we have intuition. And it's important to listen to that. It's also important to question it. So if your intuition is telling you, like, oh my gosh, on a scale of one to ten, this is a 10 problem, like probably listen to it. If it's like a five or a six problem, okay, might not be something that I have to address. I might need to let that behavior slide, right? And it'll be okay. Right. Because as we know, rebellion is normal for teenagers. They're trying to establish their independence. They really care about their social status with their friends.

Talking to teens about rebellion

SPEAKER_01 32:58

They really have a desire to be respected from their friends and from us. And so, yes, a little rebellion's normal. So, first is to like think observe the behavior that's concerning you and really try to check in with yourself, like, where is this on a scale of one to 10? And then the solution here is always, always, always conversation. Our kids need to feel like we're not judging them, we're not disappointed in them, that really we're here to support them, to understand them, and to help them make good choices. And when they feel that safety from you, you are able to have more and more conversations. And so you're able then to understand and really process like how scary is this rebellion, how bad is this on a scale of one to 10. And it gives you the opportunity to either share your values, if maybe they're being, you know, unkind or they're being super risky in their behavior, right? You get the chance to have a conversation about your family values and to help guide them in whatever they're struggling with. But you can't get there if you aren't prioritizing talking and opening up and conversations way before you ever start thinking about natural consequences. We need to understand okay, where's the rebellion coming from? Why are they rebelling? You know, checking in with ourselves is this if I had to put it on a scale of one to 10. You know, I find that a lot of myself included, like high achieving, you know, problem solver parents, everything feels like a 10. You know, I was just talking to a client yesterday, and her 12-year-old went on a school field trip and you weren't supposed to bring cell phones, and he

Discussing tech boundaries with kids

SPEAKER_01 34:51

didn't. Amazing. But she found out, she got a little notification that he was trying to like log into social media or email, I guess from someone else's phone or something like that. And she thought this was like a level 10 thing to talk about when he got back from the field trip, right? And so I just, we gotta go in and slow ourselves down and have a real honest conversation with ourselves and and decide, you know, really listen to our intuition. Like, is this really a like a level 10 thing I need to talk about? You know, or in this situation, uh, maybe instead the conversation should be focused on like, wow, that's amazing. I know that was hard leaving your phone at home. How'd that feel? How'd that go for you? How'd you, you know, what did you do when you weren't on your phone? Right. And spend time when you're talking to them filling up, I like to say, you got to fill up your bucket of really good, yummy conversations where it's there's not the temperature isn't really hot. And it's where you're proud of them and they get to feel proud of themselves. And it's those conversations that help our kids build character, build confidence. I think we all want confident kids. And we know is that character and confidence builds, typically the rebellion subsides. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 36:06

Yep. Thank you. Okay. The policy question is if you were COO of family communication, what one standard operating procedure would you mandate for every household to ensure that connection outlasts the crisis?

SPEAKER_01 36:23

I love this, Laura, because when I'm talking to my clients, I always say, look, when they were young and they were lividal, like think of yourself as like a mid-level manager in a company, right? You're really hands-on, you're very instructional, you're helping fix and solve problems, right? And that's what we do when our kids are little because that's what they need. But when they hit the preteen and teen years, they need something different from you. And I like to tell my clients, like, congratulations, you've been promoted to CEO. In your situation, you said COO, but same thing, right? We want to think about ourselves as okay, we're no longer this hands-on micromanager. We now need to be the CEO of our family. And that means that's a leadership role. That's not trying to control and fix and give punitive consequences. Right. That's trying to guide and to lead, of course, while keeping the guardrails up, right? A CEO's not going to let their revenue tank. Right. So he's got to have some guardrails, but he's also going to give his employees some room to breathe and to try things and see what works and what doesn't work and allow some growth and learning to happen. And assuming that, yeah, there's going to be some mistakes because I want my whole senior VP level to make mistakes and grow and learn from them. And so I love that you brought that up. I think that for standard operating procedures, I again, I think it starts with us and it's recognizing like, okay, my role is different now. My teens need something different from me. And so I have to show up differently. And I just love the metaphor of like, put your CEO hat on because I think immediately people go, okay, yeah, I get that.

Using a CEO mindset at home

SPEAKER_00 38:19

Right. Yes. I've been using that framework actually for this new series of the show because I really do believe that we are the CEOs of our families, and we really have to do think about how we're managing at every different level. And we can relate to that much more easily than how do I behave as a mother? How do I behave as a grandmother? And then we just put ourselves in these little boxes, but really there's a bigger picture. And I love your comparison. That is hands down the best answer I've gotten from anyone so far is yeah, if we want to, if we want to create a great company, we have to allow for people of all color creeds and thinking, and we have to encourage them to be creative. And we need to give them lots of room for themselves to live while also respecting uh the company that they're working with. And and so that would that that's a great way to visualize teenagers is really they are um they are young CEOs, and we're encouraging them to be young CEOs. And if we are, what do we do? This is a this is a world full of so much possibility these days, and we limit them by limiting them, right? Yeah, absolutely. So thanks. I love that comparison. Great answer. Thanks, Janine. It's always great to talk with you, and I want to thank you so much for your time today, and I hope you have a wonderful rest of your week.

SPEAKER_01 39:58

Well, thank you for having me back, Laura. I always enjoy talking to you. So many insightful questions, and I'm honored that I can help your audience out. So thank you.

SPEAKER_00 40:10

Would you remind the listeners of your website and some of the wonderful opportunities they have to be part of your group and your coaching?

SPEAKER_01 40:21

Oh, yeah, thank you. Yes. So my um website is my name, Janine Mushwar.com. And uh if you go on there, there's links to everything. There's a blog with articles that are really interesting. If those kind of pique your interest, hop on my newsletter list. And I think the thing that people enjoy the most is I have a five question guide that get teens talking. And so if you've got the silent treatment going on, and even if you don't, they're just great open-ended questions that really promote that connection and that conversation. Because, like we talked about, the more that you understand and and you know and you know what's going on, the calmer that you feel, and the more easier it is to be that CEO. So, yeah, my website has everything.

SPEAKER_00 41:10

I'll put a link to that in the show notes and we have a new resource library on the on the website. I'll make sure to put a link to that um that guide you you you spoke about as well. All right, thanks, Janine. Thank you, Laura.

Parenting with CEO mindset

SPEAKER_00 41:25

Janine challenged us with a powerful metaphor today. You've been promoted to CEO. Ask yourself, in your home, are you leading with a micromanagement style that stifles growth? Or are you building the guardrails that allow your teen to breathe? This week I want you to try the five simple words approach Janine shared. When you see something concerning, instead of a lecture, just ask what happened? What's the struggle? Give them the space to be the VP of their own life and see if they don't start inviting you back into the boardroom. Next week, we're welcoming back Alison Ajiti, a pediatric sleep consultant with a background in high-level finance. Last time we talked about the mechanics of sleep. Today we're looking at sleep through the lens of the invisible CEO, specifically how trauma rewires a child's motherboard and why bedtime battles are often actually safety searches. Allison will be here to help us understand why sleep is the first system to break down when a child has experienced loss. We are 2.7 million strong, still nurturing and still here. We're the ones who trade control for connection, even when the silence feels deafening. Remember, your power isn't in your punishment, it's in your presence. Keep nurturing, keep leading, and I'll see you in the next boardroom.